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[P]
Introduction to Tibetan Orthography

By rtmyers in Culture
Fri Feb 06, 2004 at 05:45:26 AM EST
Tags: Culture (all tags)
Culture

Most K5 readers have seen the Tibetan script--those lovely, angular characters that look like they're hanging down from a clothesline, flourishes above and below. But how does the Tibetan writing system actually work? Here's a brief introduction to one of the world's most dysfunctional scripts.


I'm no script virgin. I'm an armchair linguist who knows the Japanese and Korean scripts well, and has a nodding acquaintance with many others. I'm no longer shocked by letters and pieces thereof magically disappearing or changing shape or engaging in shameful public acts with each other. I've come to expect baroque and archaic rules and long lists of exceptions. But Tibetan's pure, shameless, in-your-face weirdness still managed to shock me.

Probably after studying Tibetan for ten years this would all seem obvious and natural to me. Actually, at this point I've studied it for all of one weekend, albeit an intensive 20-hour weekend with a whole semester's worth of Tibetan crammed into it. I thought I would be learning basic Tibetan but what I soon found is that it takes 20 hours just to learn Tibetan orthography. It's not until Tibetan II that you even get to basic grammar and vocabulary.

What's so strange about Tibetan? After all, they start off with an alphabet like just about every script. There are thirty characters, arranged in a neat 8x4 matrix, the two cells on the bottom right being empty. And there's a great deal of logic in the way the matrix is structured.

For instance, the first row contains "k"-like sounds, made in the throat. The second "ch"-like sounds, made on the roof of the mouth, the third dental "t" sounds, the fourth labial "p" sounds, and so on.

And the first column contains the basic unvoiced sound (for the first row, "ka"), the second a breathy, aspirated sound ("kha"), the third the voiced version ("ga") and the fourth the nasal variant ("nga"). This layout mimics the Sanskrit used as a model for the Tibetan script.

Here's how the matrix looks:

ཀཁགང ka, kha, ga, nga
ཅཆཇཉ ca, cha, ja, nya
ཏཐདན ta, tha, da, na
པཕབམ pa, pha, ba, ma
ཙཚཛཝ tsa, tsha, dza, wa
ཞཟའཡ zha, za, 'a, ya
རལཤས ra, la, sha, sa
ཧཨ  ha, a

Tibetan is a tonal language, but (thankfully) not in the Chinese fashion. Instead, each syllable, to oversimplify somewhat, has either a high or low intonation. And another elegant aspect of the arrangement of Tibetan characters into the matrix above is that in general the first two columns take the high, the last two columns the low intonation. Whether high or low, Tibetan tones do not go up or down, but stay "flat".

The lower rows depart from the regularity of the first five, but remember, the inventor of the alphabet was not inventing the sounds, just inventing ways to organize and represent them.

Can't see the characters in the table, or see empty squares instead? Then something is wrong in your universe of browsers/encodings/fonts/renderings. Your browser needs to handle Unicode, since that's how I've specified the Tibetan characters. And it needs to have access to Tibetan fonts, most likely as part of a Unicode font such as MS Arial Unicode. Sorry, we're not going to spend any more time here debugging your Tibetan display problems. You should visit the Omniglot Tibetan page, which shows the matrix, the vowel marks discussed below, and examples of Tibetan writing.

Back to Tibetan spelling. The thirty characters above can be used as is, as long as you put the a little dot after them indicating that that's the entire syllable (or "morpheme" in linguist-speak). So ག་ is kha, the Tibetan word for "mouth". We're cooking!

Each character has a built-in "a" sound (pronounced "ah"). So how would we get something like ri, for "mountain"?

Tibetan handles vowel orthography in a highly regular way. There are just five vowel sounds including the built-in "a", the others being "i", "u", "e", and "o", and each has its own symbol, placed above or below the character in question:

gigu, a hook above giving "i"
shabkyu, a hook below giving "u"
dreng-bu, a kind of accent grave, giving "e"
naro, a mark above giving "o"

So ri or "mountain" would be RA with the gigu hook above it. Unfortunately, I can't show that to you easily on this web page. The problem is that Unicode has defined only components of Tibetan script elements, as opposed to composed glyphs. (Tibetan occupies a single 256-byte "page" in the Unicode code space.) And no web browser has the logic required to compose these components on the fly into the so-called stacks or "grapheme clusters" (the "graphemes" here being the RA and the I) that are required. There's a Unicode character called COMBINING GRAPHEME JOINER which in some better world might do something useful, but it doesn't seem to. ZERO WIDTH JOINERS possibly could be interpreted in a friendly way but they aren't. To see a whole bunch of decomposed and thus completely weird-looking Tibetan text encoded using Unicode see the Tibetan Unicode Test Pages. I will studiously avoid getting involved in the religious wars as to whether or not Unicode 29.0 should define all grapheme clusters as individual code points, of which there would be several thousand.

In any case, at the moment only dedicated environments are capable of correctly rendering Tibetan. There is a hack involving MS Word. There is a Java app. Emacs supports entering and displaying Tibetan. For the Macintosh, there is the Tibetan Language Kit. All these alternatives involve a home-grown encoding together with a more-or-less custom fonts. In some cases, it may be possible to embed the glyph information into a web page, marking the Tibetan portion for rendering with the Tibetan font, allowing Tibetan to be displayed on "normal" web pages, assuming platform and browser compatibility.

The elegant architecture of Graphite should permit a Tibetan implementation but no-one has gotten around to doing it yet.

So on a web page like this I can't show you a "ri", except as a graphic.

This all seems boringly regular. But actually, this is precisely the point at which Tibetan spelling begins to get extremely hairy. Since this article cannot give a complete description of Tibetan orthography, let's just jump right in with a real-world example.

We'll use the word pronounced drup (or droop in pseudo-phonetic notation, low tone), which is the past tense of the word meaning "accomplish". Here we go: using English transliterations for each Tibetan character, it's written BA SA/GA/RA/U BA SA. And there you have it: drup. I've used spaces to separate the four "pieces" which are used to write this syllable. Bring up the image of how drup is written in a separate window and you should be able to follow the discussion more easily. You can see the four pieces, arranged left-to-right. Notice the second "piece" is stretched out vertically. That's because it's a "stack" which contains the SA/GA/RA/U arranged vertically. Some people might prefer to call this a "grapheme cluster".

OK, let's take this one step at a time. The first character is the one for BA. That's one of those thirty basic characters used in Tibetan. Why BA? Well, actually, no one knows. It's silent, and has nothing to do with the pronunciation of the word. This character is a prefix, one of several that can so function, all of which are silent when they do so. It is a prefix to the "root" character which follows.

The next piece is the tall, stacked "root" letter. Placed to the right of the BA we just wrote, it begins at the top with the the character SA. But technically, this character is a superscript, and is also silent, completely unrelated to the pronunciation of the word.

Finally we get to the character for GA. This is the heart of the stack and the entire syllable drup, and is written underneath the SA. Now to form Tibetan syllables, you mostly string the basic characters together left-to-right. But the "main" piece in each group can be a "stack", where a bunch of basic characters are arranged top-to-bottom; that stack then fits into the left-to-right sequence of the other pieces. In other words, the individual basic characters in Tibetan spread out both to the left and right and up and down from the central root character. The GA character we just added is that central root character. As we'll soon see, the GA does have a relationship to the word we are trying to spell (drup), although it's tenuous in the extreme.

Underneath the GA we write a variant of the character for RA. This is a subscript. The alert reader may guess, correctly, that the "r" sound in RA accounts for the "r" sound in the word drup. What he or she could not deduce is that it also changes the "g" sound of the GA above into a "d" sound, yielding "dra". There's no reason for this--it's just the rule. But at least we seem to be making some progress towards drup.

Still working on the same stack, we now add to the bottom the final element, the curly shabkyu, the vowel character mentioned above which changes the intrinsic "a" sound to a "u" sound, giving us "dru".

We're finished with the stack. Next we move on to the third element of the syllable, which is the character BA again; this time it's not silent, but rather puts the final "p" on the word drup. And then we're done, right?

Not so fast. We still have the final SA, another silent character, the fourth left-to-right piece of the syllable (the so-called second suffix, present in some but by no means all syllables). Then, finally, we really are done. We just write the little dot called the tsek, which terminates the entire four-piece syllable. Voila.

A scholar named Wylie came up with a way to uniquely transliterate Tibetan into Roman characters, completely round-trippable. (The word drup in "Wylie" is BSGRUBS.) This provides a handy and widely-used mechanism for inputting Tibetan into word-processing programs. Western Tibetan scholars are said to be able to read Tibetan directly from such transliterations. There is no reported research on what the effect on their brains of learning to do so was.

Of course, the Tibetans themselves need a way to spell to each other. They've come up with an elegant approach, where each component is given, followed by its position in the stack if applicable and then cumulative phonetic result. So our drup example would be spelled in Tibetan as:

BA O (meaning silent) SA GA ta (meaning below) ga (pronunciation so far) RA ta (meaning below) dra (pronunciation so far) shabkyu ("u" vowel) dru (pronunciation so far) BA drup (pronunciation so far) SA drup (final pronunciation)

Drup is hardly a unique example in terms of the exceptions and special rules involved. Write DA/RA? That's cha (bird). How about ZA/LA? That's da. A final NA puts the "n" sound on the end of the word, but also changes the preceding vowel. Or, you could do the same thing by just putting a little circle on the top of the main stack in the syllable. And so on, ad inifinitum. Don't even get me started on the variant characters used for Sanskrit borrowings.

Speaking of Sanskrit, which I know virtually nothing about, Tibetan inherits major portions of its orthography from that language, and to that extent shares with modern-day descendants such as Devanagari. It's possible writers of those languages would not find Tibetan to be quite as "dysfunctional" as this newbie did. Having said that, Sanskrit does not have the huge clusters, or the frequent silent characters of Tibetan (although it does have its own set of major difficulties, including many more characters and its rich grammar).

So what is the deal with these silent characters anyway? They clearly play a major role in resolving homonymal ambiguity in Tibetan. For instance, the word for "I, me" is pronounced "nga" and written NGA as expected, while the word for five" is also pronounced "nga" but is written LA/NGA with a silent LA. Fine and possibly useful, but other languages manage to deal with the same kind of ambiguity without resorting to such tricks. Those tricks make the learning curve markedly steeper, not only for adult foreign students but for native-speaking children as well. If the silent letters had some other meaning, perhaps semantic, it would be more understandable, but they appear not to.

It appears that in general these silent letters reflect archaic pronunciations. This theory is supported by the observation that the word "lama" (guru) is written with a silent leading BA, and in some dialects is actually pronounced "blama"./p>

How did Tibetan orthography get to be such a mess? Probably because it basically hasn't been reformed in the millennium-and-a-half since it was invented by the legendary Thon-mi Sambhota, although it seems to me that it must have been pretty baroque even back then. Just imagine trying to write English in an ur-Germanic script from 1400 years ago, with the added restriction that words today must be spelled exactly as the words they were derived from were.

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Related Links
o Omniglot Tibetan page
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o image of how drup is written
o Also by rtmyers


Display: Sort:
Introduction to Tibetan Orthography | 132 comments (114 topical, 18 editorial, 2 hidden)
It would be interesting, (2.80 / 5) (#3)
by For Whom The Bells Troll on Thu Feb 05, 2004 at 01:01:37 AM EST

if you could, perhaps, transliterate the term into another Indic script such as Devnagri or Burmese. I have half a hint that native Indic speakers wouldn't find Tibetan as "dysfunctional" as you make it out to be.

---
The Big F Word.
yudit (3.00 / 8) (#6)
by mlc on Thu Feb 05, 2004 at 02:43:52 AM EST

The multilingual editor yudit (mostly for UNIX, though apparently a Windows port is available) can input and display Tibetan. It comes with a Wylie keymap available, and you can grab the Tibetan Unicode font (and README file).

Yudit is pretty cool, because it relies very little on X11. Most of the fonts, keymaps, layout, and so on, it does by itself. So it actually tends to work, although it does not conform to any standard UI.

--
So the Berne Convention is the ultimate arbiter of truth and morality. Is this like Catholicism? -- Eight Star

+1 FP, Tibetan Orthography (1.66 / 9) (#10)
by Zerotime on Thu Feb 05, 2004 at 05:31:11 AM EST



---
"You don't even have to drink it. You just rub it on your hips and it eats its way through to your liver."
Wow, Tibetans write in little squares...nt (2.40 / 10) (#13)
by Russell Dovey on Thu Feb 05, 2004 at 08:19:23 AM EST


"Blessed are the cracked, for they let in the light." - Spike Milligan

-1, I read your whole article twice (1.50 / 14) (#19)
by Tex Bigballs on Thu Feb 05, 2004 at 01:48:56 PM EST

and I still don't understand how the study of Tibetan birds is any different than American's.

an idea for a new tattoo surfaces... (2.25 / 3) (#23)
by circletimessquare on Thu Feb 05, 2004 at 03:55:07 PM EST

thanks, a+ story, kuro5hin at it's finest ;-)

The tigers of wrath are wiser than the horses of instruction.

Tibetan language - power, beauty, context (2.84 / 19) (#26)
by just8 on Thu Feb 05, 2004 at 04:15:33 PM EST

For Indo-European language speakers, there are stranger things out there than Tibetan script (which is modeled on the Sanskrit syllabary).
Quite strange texts, for those who have learned only Indo-European languages, would probably include:  Egyptian heiroglyphs, Sumerian cuneiform, Incan khipu (knotted strings), the Mayan hieroglyphic syllabary, Chinese characters, and the Japanese mixture of Chinese characters and several syllabaries.

Strangeness depends on familiarity.  All of these examples seem to me more strange than Tibetan - but I had studied Sanskrit before Tibetan.

I wrote this before it went to voting. I'll leave it as it is (and resubmit as topical), in case you revise it for another forum.

Tibetan might be arcane and complex.  If you have studied a South Asian language and script, it is not so strange.

I visited your website. I appreciate that you are interested in various languages, in the game of Go and computer applications for that, and are into Incan metaphysics.  So am I. Small world. I appreciate your shoot from the hip humor.  The humorous writing style works on some topics. I don't think it really fits with this article.

This article is probably very difficult to follow for most people not familiar with Tibetan or South Asian languages.

Your focus on the Tibetan script for a general audience, while arcane, overly detailed and hard to follow, is not too deep.  

You seem basically to be saying: "The Tibetan script is difficult, even strange. Here are some of the rules of the language. Here are a few examples of strange scripts to represent words. There are some problems representing the Tibetan script in character rendering programs. Tibetan is a mess because it hasn't been reformed in 1400 years."  

I don't think that almost 1900 words are needed to say that.

To learn about Tibetan, starting out with the scripts seems, well, like a very frustrating thing to do. However, after your essay based on study of only 20 hours, well, I find some of your general points to be premature.

My main suggestion if you want to revise this and to stick with the topics would be to cut the article in half and simplify the examples. If you want to keep the complexity, then some subsections with subtitles would help.  It would be a good idea to add to that a bit more historical research on the development of Tibetan in linguistic and historical context.  For instance, Tibetan is a Sino-Chinese language but uses an Indo-European derived script due to the importation of Buddhism and the creation of the script in Tibet around the same time to translate religious texts. As it is, the detail of the article doesn't match the points.

Here is a listing of resources for the study of Tibetan, from the website of the government of Tibet in exile:
Learn Tibetan Language
http://www.tibet.com/Language/

I've studed intro Sanskrit and Tibetan. And, I've studied Japanese (year in college) as well as several romance languages.  I learned some Russian recently.  

A general statement: Scripts at first can get in the way of learning the power, depth, beauty, and living richness of a language.  In my opinion, learning the meaning and pronunciation of 200 words of vocabulary of a language is much more helpful for getting a feel for culture than is learning a script.

You can learn simple vocabulary, conjugations, grammar, etc., without knowing scripts.

Good ways to learn the meaning and beauty of Tibetan and Sanskrit (dead, but not dead) would be from:
 - speaking with native or accomplished scholarly speakers
 - phonetic transliterations (not Wylie)
 - word for word translations of texts

While Tibetan orthography may seem to be a mess, it has some important functions with regard to meaning and visualization.  

According to Buddhists, written Tibetan was specifically constructed as a liturgical language.

Tibetan Buddhist meditations involve very complicated visualizations. The visualization process of working with Tibetan mantras is ornate and beautiful, involving sometimes taking apart words a syllable at a time. However, knowledge of written Tibetan is not necessary to get a deep understanding of the culture.

Here are two anecdotes about the relative utility of scripts:
1. I once assisted a Tibetan lama to translate some prayers into English.  The scriptural Tibetan was multi-layered and quite profound.  I didn't need to know the script (though I did and have since forgotten it). He transliterated everything (unevenly). We worked up our own transliteration. That translation work was a luminous experience - a glimpse into quite precise, very colorful meanings. I was able to understand through this study that Tibetan as a philosophical language is quite powerful and precise and elegantly beautiful at times. For instance, lama translates as la = great and ma = mother. Lamas are great mothers or gurus. On a lighter note, dorje (a very important word in Tibetan-perhaps the most important) means vajra (in Sanskrit) means diamond and adamantine and indestructible. Dorje also means penis. You can only get at the multiple layers of something like this through study in context. A focus on text first might well scare someone off from the very colorful, human and at the same time profound context.
2. I attending a teaching once by Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche on the innermost of the nine yogas in Tibetan Buddhism. He chanted a bit in Tibetan in the beginning.  Then, there was this clear discourse on the nature of mind and emptiness and nonduality.  Then, he explained a meditation. Then, there was a practice session with a bit of chanting with keys given before hand as to what beginners should do.  The meditation for people I talked to was very deep and very amazing and clear.  Language was not an impediment.

We have a focus on logic and linguistics in the rational west as a way to understand cultural phenomena.  However, deep of cultural transmissions can happen more through interpretation (as with the translator in example 1 above) and in practice (as in example 2).

Here is some cultural background on why Tibetan script did not change:
The way to understand the history of the Tibetan script is in its development to communicate religious language.

Many significant religious teachings and philosophies were imported very developed from India (and quite complex after 1000 years of development there) to Tibet from about the 8th Century onward. Significant developments also occurred early on in Tibetan history over the next 500 years (with a several hundred year gap due to religious suppression).

A major occupation in Tibetan culture was monasticism. A 1/3 of the population used to live in monasteries.

The religious nature of the scripts development and ongoing transmission was a conservative force on the learning of Tibetan.

I'm not advocating traditionalism.  Nor am I claiming that philosophy did not evolve in Tibet. It is just that a lot had developed already early on, 9 C. to 14 C. of common era. Institutional structures were conservative, aiming to conserve their cultural riches.

I am advocating learning languages, for those so interested, in context. When there is a living linguistic tradition, it seems a good thing to start there to understand the context and beauty of a language including its script.

In closing: Well, I ventured beyond the scope of the article but my critique calls for that.

Personally, I believe that the sooner that Tibetan, Sikkhim, Bhutanese, and Japanese lines of vajrayana (which integrate in various ways inquiry into the self through sensual, rational and spiritual means) are established as realization traditions in Western cultures and languages the better. The way to get there has been by learning from the cultural experts -- not from the text in abstraction (remembering that the text though not the language was primarily developed and used for religious purposes). Tibetan culture is fused with Tibetan spirituality.

Or, you can get the essence of the spiritual tradition now in English from teachers like the Dalai Lama, Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche, or any of thousands of lamas and scholars.

The above doesn't invalidate your points about how complex the script is.  But, I hope people will understand that you can enter into Tibetan language in ways that are much more rewarding than contemplating the complex script. I hope you include some more historical and cultural points in a revision of the article. It would be interesting to compare Tibetan with Chinese characters and languages with very strange characteristics to Western eyes and ears. Something to keep in mind is that the many irregular spellings and grammatical forms in English give trouble even to Indo-European language speakers.

Well, so. I do enjoy your shoot from hip writing style. I hope you submit more articles here - about computer Go programs, maybe?


comparison (none / 1) (#36)
by debillitatus on Fri Feb 06, 2004 at 12:52:21 AM EST

The similarities between this and a lot of South Asian scripts is apparent (aside from the fact that obviously the pronounciation is all fscked). At least we still have our ka-kha-ga's.

But it seems like it would be more useful in this article to think more about the comparison one can make to, say, Devanagari. I imagine that this would give a lot more people a frame of reference.

Anyways, this is definitely good stuff.

Damn you and your daily doubles, you brigand!

Da da da (none / 2) (#37)
by JChen on Fri Feb 06, 2004 at 01:02:09 AM EST

So, has any of you scholarly types asked the question of what use will this be to today's society exactly?

Let us do as we say.
You don't need to go so far (3.00 / 4) (#41)
by Shubin on Fri Feb 06, 2004 at 06:42:47 AM EST

You don't need to go so far for strangeness. Let's take Russian - an almost normal European language, with many words taken from German, English, Dutch. It has been reformed in 1918. But how it looked before ?
Here are two sample rules :
There were two different letters, denoting sound 'e'. One called 'ye', other called 'yat`' Which one to use ? Easy : if the word in question, translated into Ukrainian, would have 'i' in the corresponding place, write 'yat`'. Otherwise, write 'ye'. Quite simple, isn't it ? Just learn another language and you're done.
The similar situation was with two letters for 'f' : 'ef' and 'fita'.
Interesting fact : among others 'fita' has been used in words that in English has 'th' (as in 'thick', not in 'the') in that place. Example : Theodor would be Feodor, Theofil = Feofil etc.
This letter is not used since 1918 and is completely forgotten. But a new word, borrowed from English in mid-70s follows this rule. It is natural for Russian to pronounce 'th' as 't' or 's', but word 'thing' became 'fen`ka'. And it's not a literature Russian, it's street slang.

Learn about origins of languages (none / 0) (#42)
by zhukher on Fri Feb 06, 2004 at 07:23:16 AM EST

http://omniglot.com/writing/tibetan.htm here is how tibetan actually looks with all of the explanations in addition to this post go to http://omniglot.com and find out where your writing originated

It might as well be Sanskrit to me.. (none / 1) (#43)
by A55M0NKEY on Fri Feb 06, 2004 at 07:49:59 AM EST

______________ || @ ' U|| C Spinnenpuke.

Please Translate For Me... (2.07 / 13) (#44)
by CheeseburgerBrown on Fri Feb 06, 2004 at 07:54:50 AM EST

...The following helpful travel phrases for Tibet:

"The yak hair in this butter is of exceptional quality."

"I am very cold, and wish to die now.

"My face has chapped off."

"There is a Chinaman standing on my colon."

"So, you guys really dig wearing orange, huh?"

"Nice haircut."

"Can I pet the Dalai Lama?"

"Ooooh...mountains."


___
I am from a small, unknown country in the north called Ca-na-da. We are a simple, grease-loving people who enjoy le weekend de ski. Personally, I pref
Cf. English? (2.71 / 7) (#46)
by dash2 on Fri Feb 06, 2004 at 09:26:26 AM EST

Check out this insane language: cough rough though through slough thorough dough hiccough
------------------------
If I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am become sounding brass, or a clanging cymbal.
a test (none / 0) (#51)
by MonkeyMan on Fri Feb 06, 2004 at 12:48:41 PM EST

<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.1 plus MathML 2.0//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/MathML2/dtd/xhtml-math11-f.dtd" [ ENTITY mathml "http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML" ]> <html xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml"> this is a test

<math xmlns="&mathml;"> <munder> <mi>ང</mi> <mi>B</mi> </munder> </math> </math>

End of test.

MathML (none / 0) (#53)
by MonkeyMan on Fri Feb 06, 2004 at 01:04:18 PM EST

If Rusty would enable MathML in the headers he spits out then stacks could be faked somewhat. Mozilla supports MathML.

The code for RI would look like this:

<math xmlns="&mathml;">
<munder>
<mi>&#3938;</mi>
<mi>&#3954;</mi>
</munder>
</math>

Try this fragement out at the tester page.

[ Sorry that my last post escaped ]

Om Mani Padme Hum (none / 1) (#79)
by zentara on Sun Feb 08, 2004 at 06:24:14 AM EST

Don't forget that the basics of Tibetan religous beliefs, are far more advanced than most Westerners are able to comprehend. It's tantric. I was inspired to put this on my site 2 days ago....synchronicity? Om-Mani-Padme-Hum.jpg

the meaning

Feel free to copy it to your disk. The harddrive acts like a Tibetan Spinning Wheel, and having this on it, brings "good karma" as you operate your computer.

silent characters change meaning in English, too! (none / 0) (#85)
by vdvo on Sun Feb 08, 2004 at 05:20:32 PM EST

From the article:

So what is the deal with these silent characters anyway? They clearly play a major role in resolving homonymal ambiguity in Tibetan. For instance, the word for "I, me" is pronounced "nga" and written NGA as expected, while the word for five" is also pronounced "nga" but is written LA/NGA with a silent LA. Fine and possibly useful, but other languages manage to deal with the same kind of ambiguity without resorting to such tricks. Those tricks make the learning curve markedly steeper, not only for adult foreign students but for native-speaking children as well. If the silent letters had some other meaning, perhaps semantic, it would be more understandable, but they appear not to.

You know what? I found this exact phenomenon in a slightly more common language: English! Witness this: "night" - and "knight"! :-) I challenge others to find other examples as I'm pretty sure there are more.

(Of course, I'm linguistically ignorant, so it's possible that there is some difference between the "nga" case and the "night" case that I haven't noticed.)



It is suprising (none / 0) (#87)
by bankind on Mon Feb 09, 2004 at 02:23:19 AM EST

That of all the politically charged K5ers, no one has mentioned that only a language of this complexity could arise in a society were the educated completed ignored the commoners. Tibet is a very split society, even post liberation. The failures of the learned to take needed reforms to include the peasants (and merchants) in the educational system is part of the reason for the backwardness of the society.

I've spent significant time in Tibet, and the truest aspect of that society is the complete isolation of the lower classes. It is shocking how much of this evil is portrayed in the language.

And to dispel this whole religious, Buddhist thing, Tibetans are rough brawlers. A monastery is like a private boarding school, everyone carries knifes, all they do is smoke, drink, and play billiards (a good thing). But the monks play B-ball like the political refugees in Scarface. If this spirituality bullshit was soooo important, they wouldn't all play basketball like Bill Laimbeer.

"Insurgents are blowing up pipelines and police stations, geysers of sewage are erupting from the streets, and the electricity is off most of the time -- but we've given Iraq the gift of supply-side economics." -Krugman

dysfunctional? (none / 0) (#88)
by thepunekar on Mon Feb 09, 2004 at 07:38:13 AM EST

what do you mean by dysfunctional? As anyone who's done any studies in the Indic languages can easily see, Tibetan script is based on devanagari. And just like in devanagari, all the syllabels are very well arranged on the basis of which part of the mouth is used to speak them. Also, there's only one way to write any spoken word using these scripts, and any written word has only one pronunciation. You call that dysfuctional?

Tibetan is an extremely advanced language (none / 0) (#119)
by losang on Sun Feb 15, 2004 at 11:03:02 AM EST

Tibetan is a very scientific language. It was developed for the purpose of translating the extremely technical Buddhist philosophical texts from Sanskrit. Anyone who has read Tibetan philosohy will recognize its parallels to mathematics. Buddhist philosophical Tibetan is extremely precise and anyone who has tried to honestly translate it into English understands this. It is like translating mathematics into words.

Second, there are hard and clear rules for pronunciation in Tibetan. Compared with English, Tibetan much more precise in its pronunciation. If a new word is invented anyone who knows Tibetan would be able to pronounce it without first hearing someone else say the word. The same is not true for English. Of course there are various dialects but this is not important.

Comments on LA/NGA (none / 0) (#133)
by rtmyers on Mon Jun 21, 2004 at 12:42:39 AM EST

I'm posting this on behalf of "john" (chessyogin at aol dot com), who mailed these comments to me, not being able to post them here because of the inability to register as a new user.

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hi mate

i just read your article about learning tibetan orthography.  i've been learning tibetan on and off for 10 years.  not got so far with it but further than most and the alphabet is indeed a bit strange to start with although i'm completely at home with it now as you'd expect.

i'd like to point out that " LA/NGA with a silent LA."  i'm not sure who you learned tibetan from, maybe they didn't want to frighten a beginner's class too much.  while the la in lnga is indeed silent, it does have an effect on pronounciation.  this is the same for all the nasalised fourth column.

but, lnga rnga and snga are all pronounced in the same high pitched nga.  eastern tibetan has many more homonyms than central tibet.  like you say the prefixes indicate older meanings and stephen beyer covers this in his classical tibetan book which is a linguistic description of tibetan rather than a teach yourself book.  in ladhakh the prefixes are still pronounced (or at least a lot of them are).  i recently met a ladhaki and the pronounciation was just like the actual written tibetan (which i believe is much the same case in western tibet).

so, to give an example, when the ladhaki was saying "go for refuge" he was saying: "skyabs" (maybe he didn't pronounce the final s come to think of it), just like the written tibetan.  but in central tibet this would be pronounced "kyab" and in eastern tibetan "chap"!

the pronounciation of lnga and nga is not the same.  adding the la + nga makes the nga sound high pitched when compared to a nga without a la.  hope that makes sense!  if you're interested i suggest picking up a copy of translating buddhism from tibetan by joe wilson.  he goes into pronounciation in great detail although if you have only a passing interest it's a bit expensive to buy.  there's a tape that can be bought to accompany the book as well.  i think the tape just covers the first couple of chapters.

as so few people knew how to write/read tibetan i guess that's why there's such a difference between written and modern day spoken tibetan.

would have posted this on the forum but it won't let new people register.

cheers

john

Introduction to Tibetan Orthography | 132 comments (114 topical, 18 editorial, 2 hidden)
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